00:00:01: You know, you buy me out, but I'm not signing any non-compete

00:00:05: or anything like that.

00:00:05: I'm telling you right now, I am starting another company doing exactly this.

00:00:10: And he was like, okay, good luck. Okay.

00:00:12: So that's when I started World Famous Ink. You.

00:00:17: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to a new episode of the tales

00:00:20: from the Needle Tattoo podcast. My name is actually one.

00:00:23: I talk to people from the industry and to tattoo artists from all over the world.

00:00:28: And today

00:00:28: we got a very, very special guest here at the Gods of Ink Tattoo convention.

00:00:32: It's Lou, the founder of world famous Lou.

00:00:35: What's up?

00:00:36: Hey, how's it going, everybody?

00:00:38: Glad to be here.

00:00:40: in Frankfort. the Gods of Ink show.

00:00:43: it's pretty exciting.

00:00:44: Amazing show, very crowded here today.

00:00:47: Tons of artists, tons of amazing artists.

00:00:50: I should say. Top best in the world.

00:00:53: And, some great brands, you know, tons of brands.

00:00:57: You know, big brands like, from all around the world that come here

00:01:01: and, you know, it's great to come to this show.

00:01:04: It's very similar to the London show, which was, big show for us.

00:01:09: we would go out there and meet a lot of the distributors

00:01:13: of our products, all from all around the world would show up in London.

00:01:17: And this is what's going on here in Frankfurt now.

00:01:20: Yeah.

00:01:21: This is so cool that Mickey, moved everything

00:01:24: from London to Frankfurt because it was so unexpected there.

00:01:27: But I think I've never had the chance to go to the London

00:01:30: Tattoo convention before, because, yeah, I never thought that it was.

00:01:34: And sometimes you know. So.

00:01:36: Yeah.

00:01:36: Yeah, yeah, it was, it was my favorite one to go to.

00:01:40: And just because the, the people that went there were not just local people

00:01:45: or people from London or England or, you know, it was basically everybody

00:01:50: who was anybody in the industry from around the world.

00:01:53: Yeah.

00:01:54: This is also something that I really like about this convention here,

00:01:57: because you will meet like a whole of tattoo Germany especially,

00:02:02: and also like probably tattooing Europe here right now.

00:02:06: This is so right.

00:02:08: so can you please

00:02:09: introduce yourself to the audience so that they know?

00:02:12: Sure.

00:02:14: Lou Rubino

00:02:16: been in the tattoo game all my life.

00:02:18: started out as, hanging around my, father's tattoo shop.

00:02:22: Really was an artist.

00:02:23: Yeah. Cool.

00:02:24: a second generation artist.

00:02:27: you know, my father, when I first, you know, I was in high school, and I was,

00:02:32: like, had a huge interest in tattoos, and I wanted to be a tattoo artist.

00:02:36: And he was kind of like,

00:02:37: you know, those days tattoos were looked at very differently than they are today.

00:02:41: And it wasn't as much of a great art as it is today.

00:02:44: You know, the artists are incredible

00:02:46: that are doing tattooing and, have gotten involved.

00:02:49: But, my father kind of was trying to push me away from the industry.

00:02:54: Really? Yeah.

00:02:55: Yeah, he he was like, I go do something else, kid, you know, get out of his shop.

00:02:59: You know, you don't belong here.

00:03:01: You know, go find a better life, you know.

00:03:03: Do something with your life. Yeah.

00:03:04: Do something with your life.

00:03:05: Become a doctor or a lawyer or something like that.

00:03:08: You know, I was like, nah, this is what I want to do.

00:03:11: You know, I love it. It's it's exciting.

00:03:13: It's, you know, I used to sit there color,

00:03:14: and my father actually created little coloring books for kids.

00:03:18: Really know him.

00:03:19: And one of the artists that worked with him,

00:03:21: created these coloring books that, you know, so when, when people would come

00:03:25: in, families would come in and the kids would get

00:03:27: give them a coloring book so that they could color.

00:03:29: And they were coloring traditional tattoos.

00:03:32: So it was pretty cool.

00:03:33: So I grew up coloring these coloring books of traditional tattoos, you know, and,

00:03:39: you know,

00:03:39: it was, definitely, an interesting, place to be.

00:03:43: You know, in those days, tattooing was, very different.

00:03:46: You know, the crowds that came in, the culture was very different.

00:03:49: It was looked it was frowned upon, you know,

00:03:53: I mean, you still get some of that today, but not nothing like it was back then.

00:03:57: Yeah, definitely.

00:03:58: Yeah.

00:03:58: So in Germany, I can just tell I'm tattooing since 2010 professionally.

00:04:02: And I can just tell this was the decade ended where

00:04:05: all the biker clubs and everything got the hands on stuff.

00:04:08: So then it became more free.

00:04:10: I don't know how it was in the States before, but there,

00:04:13: you weren't allowed to just open up a shop in a city.

00:04:16: You just needed to go to the, to the biker boss and said, like, yeah,

00:04:20: here's my work. What do you think?

00:04:23: yeah.

00:04:23: I mean, there was some of that, but then there was, you know, a lot of,

00:04:26: you know, there's there was a lot of freedoms to,

00:04:29: you know, my father, you know, opened up his shop and,

00:04:33: you know, there were like, biker clubs coming in there and, you know,

00:04:36: sometimes raising hell or sometimes, you know, getting tattooed.

00:04:39: So, you know, you got to, find your way,

00:04:44: to work with people, you know, and, you know, and.

00:04:47: Yeah, and you adjust to situations, but, yeah,

00:04:51: I mean, it was cool, you know, being around the tattoo

00:04:53: shop that and then, you know, finally, after I graduated high school,

00:04:57: I told my dad that, you know, this is what I'm doing, I'm not going to college.

00:05:01: And he was like, okay, let's do it then, you know?

00:05:04: And he, he sat me down in the chair and, like, showed me the machines.

00:05:08: And I had a, you know, a very old school style apprenticeship

00:05:12: taking part, taking apart coil machines

00:05:15: down to the frame and then rebuilding them. And,

00:05:19: you know, building

00:05:20: new machines with just frames and coils, you know, we even wrapped coils and,

00:05:26: you know, shrink wrap them and, you know, did the whole nine yards, you know,

00:05:31: I mean, it was, you know, building needles, like,

00:05:34: you know, a lot of these artists today don't realize how easy they have it.

00:05:38: Like, we couldn't just call up somebody and order needles.

00:05:41: It didn't exist. You have to solve them by yourself.

00:05:43: Yeah, we would order the needle. So.

00:05:45: So, you know, I spent probably the first year

00:05:48: just working in the studio, soldering needles, making tubes, building machines,

00:05:54: you know, doing, doing all of the chores around the studio, you know,

00:05:58: so it was an old school apprenticeship, you know,

00:06:01: hand drawing stuff, you know, prepping, stencils.

00:06:05: Well, we had, you know, acetate plastic stencils, the cool ones.

00:06:09: Yeah. Yeah.

00:06:09: So, those were pretty cool.

00:06:12: I mean, very difficult to work with.

00:06:14: Nothing like, what it is today.

00:06:16: You know, you put the stencil on and especially with some of these, creams

00:06:20: that they got today. Yeah. I mean, they stick on, like, solid.

00:06:22: You can wipe over it a thousand times and it doesn't go away.

00:06:26: And you use speed stick right?

00:06:27: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, the speed stick was that.

00:06:29: It was the bomb. Yeah.

00:06:32: but you know, when you put that plastic acetate stencil on

00:06:35: and you put a little charcoal powder in there and,

00:06:39: you know, put that on the body, you know, one wipe and it was gone.

00:06:42: Yeah.

00:06:42: And it was like, oh, man, what do I do now?

00:06:45: You know, I'm like screwed.

00:06:47: So, you know, you got to learn to just even,

00:06:52: you know, just freehand it and go, you know, you had no choice.

00:06:56: You couldn't stop.

00:06:57: There was no Pinterest around where you can just look at the reference

00:07:00: and be like, yeah, okay, I'm doing it quite the same.

00:07:02: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:07:03: And so it was cool because I got to start

00:07:07: at that stage and see the transition, you know, over to,

00:07:12: you know the stencils over to the art like Google.

00:07:15: You know like all of a sudden people are coming in with images from Google.

00:07:19: Like you know, it was like, wow, what the hell is this?

00:07:21: You know, people are bringing us stuff. Can you tattoo this?

00:07:24: Can you tattoo that?

00:07:25: Meanwhile, was I mean, primarily most people walked in the door

00:07:29: and picked the design off the wall.

00:07:31: Yeah.

00:07:31: You know, we had the walls covered with all the tattoos and,

00:07:34: somebody would walk in and just say, I want that one.

00:07:38: And, you know, we even had like a little price list on there, like with the prices.

00:07:43: And, you know, they were lettered and the letter had the price, you know.

00:07:47: Like small, medium and large, also like variations for it.

00:07:52: it depended like, you know, there were different variations and.

00:07:54: Yeah, I mean, a lot of like,

00:07:56: you know, there was like, some old flash, like, picture machines.

00:07:59: Flash was one of the real old ones.

00:08:01: And then then you had like, the J.D.

00:08:03: Crowe stuff coming in, and that was that was a little more colorful

00:08:07: and but it was simple art, you know, it was really, easy to do.

00:08:12: And, you know, I used to keep a stack of stencils in my stage,

00:08:15: and we had a very busy shop.

00:08:17: I mean, it was a walk in studio.

00:08:19: we didn't take appointments.

00:08:20: It was first come, first serve. Cool.

00:08:22: So, you know, people would come in and, you know, we would open at 12 noon

00:08:27: and I would get there and there'd be a line of people

00:08:30: waiting to get in the door to sign the, you know, waiting list.

00:08:34: So they would get on the list and,

00:08:37: you know, and then we would start tattooing

00:08:39: right away, you know, so I would, I would go home at night because I

00:08:43: the other thing is, is like, we closed at ten, so we were open

00:08:45: 12 to 10, but we would stay.

00:08:47: We went close to like 12 one, two, three in the morning, you know,

00:08:51: just trying to finish clear the room of all the tattoos, you know.

00:08:54: All day, every day, all. Day, every day.

00:08:57: It was, it was, it was, a lot of work.

00:09:00: And then I would go home and actually I had a little set up a little table

00:09:04: where I would solder my needles so that I could work the next day.

00:09:07: So I would sort of the needles, and then I would go in,

00:09:11: to the shop in the morning or early, clean them up and put them

00:09:14: in the autoclave and, you know, get, get it ready to work, you know.

00:09:18: So and while that was

00:09:19: working in the autoclave, I would, you know, start working on some drawings

00:09:23: if I had a couple people that I knew were coming in or something, you know. So,

00:09:28: but yeah, it was,

00:09:30: it was definitely, very different than, today's, style of tattooing.

00:09:36: you know, there were, there were certain tattoos that I would do that

00:09:38: because people would walk in and pick the same thing all the time. Yeah.

00:09:41: So there was certain times I would I would do the same tattoo over and over,

00:09:45: like five, six, seven, eight times in a day, you know, in between other tattoos.

00:09:50: But, you know, I would do that same one over and over.

00:09:54: In the end, you wouldn't need to stencil that because you knew it before, you know.

00:09:58: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:10:00: I mean I even remember like there was this one Rose on on

00:10:03: the wall was a jade crow sheet, and it had a bunch of roses on it.

00:10:08: And it was, in our shop, we had, like, the stencils under a file,

00:10:12: you know, like a number on the. Yeah.

00:10:14: And it was sheet number 330.

00:10:16: Yeah. Was sheet number 338.

00:10:18: And letter D was like the price on it.

00:10:20: I remember 330 8DI had that, I had a stack of those in my station

00:10:23: just because it was, it was so com and every, every, every woman walked in

00:10:27: I want I want that one. Yeah.

00:10:29: And you know, that was a thing too.

00:10:30: It was like mostly back then most women got tiny tattoos.

00:10:34: You know, they didn't get a chest. Right.

00:10:36: There's little devils and stuff on.

00:10:38: The chest or on the on the hip, you know, or on the ass, you know.

00:10:43: So it was always, you know, these tiny little tattoos.

00:10:46: And then, you know, I think that the big thing that changed, that was the,

00:10:51: tramp stamp tattoos, you know, when people started coming in and getting, the 90s.

00:10:56: Yeah, yeah, the, the lower back, small tattoos.

00:11:00: And then they became bigger and bigger and bigger.

00:11:02: And before you know, it, there they became pretty large tattoos, you know?

00:11:07: and then from there,

00:11:09: I saw a lot of, females getting more tattoos

00:11:12: and getting them bigger in different locations and, you know, down the leg and,

00:11:18: you know, shoulders and, you know, so in and you started getting them on the arms.

00:11:23: But, you know, when I first started, it was mostly men getting tattooed.

00:11:27: and then when the tramp stamp

00:11:30: faced started, it was becoming big.

00:11:32: By the way, is it it became more and more women getting tattooed.

00:11:38: So I think that that was a big evolution time in tattooing,

00:11:43: where, you know, it changed over to just being,

00:11:46: you know, at some point it got to like 50, 50, you know, men and women.

00:11:51: And then,

00:11:51: you know, sometimes it was even more women getting tattooed in the shop than men.

00:11:55: So, I think that was a big transition time.

00:11:59: Yeah. That was like the 90s.

00:12:00: I remember tribal, too, was like a big thing and. Yeah.

00:12:03: Oh, man, I used to hate the tribal arm bands.

00:12:06: But they are also coming back.

00:12:07: They just look pretty different now

00:12:09: because they are not that black and solid anymore.

00:12:11: But they are more, more decent, you know, they look like presented to us now.

00:12:15: Yeah. This is a this is what how they like it now.

00:12:17: Yeah. Yeah.

00:12:18: And then there was the barbed wire,

00:12:21: you know, around the arm and people get.

00:12:24: In this and represent.

00:12:25: Oh, yeah. Once she got that tattoo, it was like over.

00:12:28: Everybody wanted it, you know?

00:12:31: but yeah, the tribal I remember we had this one guy

00:12:33: used to come into the shop and, he was just covered in tribal work.

00:12:38: I mean, like, head to toe.

00:12:39: And I mean, back then, I mean, you know, like, you didn't see

00:12:43: as many people that covered in tattoos was a statement.

00:12:46: Yeah, it was a big statement.

00:12:48: And then,

00:12:49: we had this other kid

00:12:50: because we started doing piercing in the studio in the 90s, too. And,

00:12:55: we had this kid who came in and got a ton of piercings,

00:12:58: and, I mean, we put like 50 holes in his face, you know?

00:13:01: And, yeah, it was, we call them Holy Boy

00:13:06: because. He was shining all the. Time.

00:13:07: It was like, you know, he just had all these holes in his face, and he was like.

00:13:11: He was a young kid.

00:13:12: He was only like, 19, 20 years old, you know?

00:13:14: And he was like, covered in holes.

00:13:16: But, yeah, it was funny.

00:13:18: We had, like, nicknames for all the customers.

00:13:20: I used to come in and then, you know, I found, like, later

00:13:25: on, it started, you know, growing more and more popular tattoos.

00:13:30: And, you know, we had,

00:13:32: all different people coming in, you got.

00:13:34: And then you started getting, like, you know, regular businessmen coming

00:13:37: in and, you know, taking off their suits and getting tattooed.

00:13:40: And, you know, you see. The Japanese bodies, you. That is.

00:13:43: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah yeah, yeah.

00:13:46: And, you know, we used to get a lot of, older men

00:13:49: that would come in that had, like, no tattoos and start getting tattooed

00:13:53: at, like, you know, 60 years old and then,

00:13:56: you know, by the time they're 70, they're like covered, you know.

00:14:00: So it was it was cool, you know, to see that, you know,

00:14:04: evolution and change and all this big work starting to happen.

00:14:08: I mean, then later, much later on came out the TV shows and everything.

00:14:12: And I think that that really changed a lot, too, in the industry.

00:14:16: Just the whole, you know, people getting to see what's going on

00:14:20: in the shops a little bit more and see the art, you know, because,

00:14:24: you know, years ago, like, people didn't look at it as much of an art as they do

00:14:29: today, you know, I mean, it's definitely an amazing art.

00:14:32: I mean, there's some really talented, amazing artists and it's come a long way.

00:14:38: you know, and I always like to do things that were

00:14:40: to try and bring the tattoo industry more out

00:14:43: into the public, you know, into the face and the eyes of the public.

00:14:46: Yeah. You know, kind of like the TV shows did.

00:14:49: I had open one studio in a mall, you know, so that was kind of cool.

00:14:53: you know, you had people that were going there shopping in the mall

00:14:56: and they would walk into the studio and and take a look because it was easy too.

00:15:01: So to go in our other studio

00:15:03: that my father originally started, it was a it was a separate building.

00:15:07: You had to drive into the parking lot.

00:15:09: Okay, okay, get out of the car, go into the studio.

00:15:13: And it was scary, you know, like you never been in a tattoo parlor before,

00:15:17: and you just see this building that's, you know, what.

00:15:20: Was the name of the shop?

00:15:21: Tattoo. Loose tattoo Museum. Oh, yeah.

00:15:23: Cool. Yeah.

00:15:24: So, Yeah. So it.

00:15:27: And you couldn't even see inside.

00:15:28: There wasn't, like, windows that you could see inside.

00:15:30: There was like a sign hanging in the window and stuff, you know?

00:15:33: So it was, it was a little scary for people and that kind of like, you know,

00:15:37: being in the mall, kind of like, you know, open their eyes a little bit to it.

00:15:41: So that was cool.

00:15:42: And then, I had a little bit later on, I had opened up, a tattoo studio

00:15:48: inside the, sports arena with the, New York Islanders hockey team.

00:15:53: Oh, okay.

00:15:54: So, that was, a cool experience.

00:15:58: and again.

00:15:59: You just manage this or do you also work there by yourself, like.

00:16:03: Yeah. No, I used to work there, manage it.

00:16:05: You know, I had.

00:16:07: I was working I mean, like tattooing.

00:16:09: Oh, yeah. No, we tattooed them. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. No.

00:16:11: So it was, it was all over, like hockey news.

00:16:13: All all over. It was on ESPN.

00:16:16: Sports Illustrated did a story on it.

00:16:20: yeah.

00:16:20: It was the first ever tattoo parlor inside of professional sports arena.

00:16:24: I haven't heard from that before.

00:16:26: That it's even possible to. Yeah, open up the studio there.

00:16:28: But why not, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:16:31: So, the way the, it was in the Nassau Coliseum

00:16:34: in Long Island, New York and New York Island, hockey team played there.

00:16:38: And, you know, the way the stadium was,

00:16:41: it had a big circle around the, around the outside.

00:16:45: And, you know, that was like your hallway to get to your seats, you know,

00:16:49: and they had all the vendors out there like the hot dogs and,

00:16:52: you know, food, beers. And stuff.

00:16:54: You know, and.

00:16:55: Yeah, and we set up right in that circle.

00:16:58: And, it was cool because I designed the shop to look like a penalty box.

00:17:02: I called it the penalty box. Perfect.

00:17:05: It's really cool.

00:17:06: So, you know, we made it like a, penalty box.

00:17:09: It had this wall around it, and, you know, you had to open up the gate

00:17:12: just like a penalty box to walk into it, and, Yeah.

00:17:16: And and it was cool because people would come to these games.

00:17:20: And then in the beginning I was like,

00:17:21: how many people are really going to get tattooed at the game?

00:17:24: But they loved it.

00:17:26: They absolutely loved it.

00:17:27: And they were able to, you know,

00:17:29: we made up a whole bunch of flash designs of, New York Islanders,

00:17:33: you know, logos with hockey sticks and all kinds of different designs like that.

00:17:37: And, the, you know, the all the, the players even got

00:17:41: tattooed to like, a lot of the, you know, the hockey, players.

00:17:44: Before the game.

00:17:45: You just tattooed the fans afterwards. The team.

00:17:47: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:17:48: So, it was cool.

00:17:50: And then and then they would,

00:17:51: they would sign autographs while they were getting tattooed

00:17:54: and stuff, so people would hang around and watch them get tattooed.

00:17:57: So, and it was cool because you had like, you know,

00:18:00: these people are coming and paying for a ticket to watch a game.

00:18:03: And there were TVs out, out in the circle.

00:18:06: And they would they would watch it on that TV getting tattooed.

00:18:10: So it's like, funny that they're they're paying for a ticket.

00:18:12: Yeah. Yeah. They're sitting there getting tattooed watching it on TV.

00:18:15: I mean. They're supporting their teams or. Whatnot.

00:18:19: but, yeah.

00:18:21: that was a lot of fun.

00:18:22: You know, we had a really good time with it.

00:18:24: And, you know, we did a lot of promotion with that.

00:18:27: And, you know, it was cool.

00:18:28: I like, I like to I did some unique promotions with my studio.

00:18:32: We also we did a promotion set up.

00:18:34: We didn't tattoo at,

00:18:37: the Jones Beach Amphitheater, you know, so that

00:18:39: that was like a it's like a big concert hall, in New York.

00:18:44: And it's, on the beach and it's open air.

00:18:47: Yeah. And, yeah.

00:18:48: And I mean, many major, major bands are all playing there and stuff.

00:18:53: and we used to go there and just, you know, we had merch that we would sell

00:18:57: and, you know, it was it was interesting because it would get

00:19:02: it was always like sunny in the daytime and it was hot.

00:19:05: So people would get there and it would be warm.

00:19:08: And then as soon as that sun went down, it got cold.

00:19:11: So we was we started selling sweatshirts and yeah, just.

00:19:15: Opportunistic, you.

00:19:16: Know, but they, they had our logo with a studio on it.

00:19:19: So you know, people were

00:19:20: walking around like filling the stadium with logos of our tattoo studio.

00:19:24: So it was a great way of advertising, you know.

00:19:27: And you know, we social media was a big back then.

00:19:31: We didn't have, all these, social media platforms,

00:19:36: you know, maybe a little mine was a Myspace.

00:19:39: I even remember Myspace.

00:19:41: It was there for our, for bands and stuff, you know, we used it

00:19:45: there back in the days. No band had, like, a website.

00:19:48: Everybody had, like, myspace.com slash, and then the band name.

00:19:51: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:19:53: But really cool that that you did

00:19:55: all this effort before social media because it sounds like,

00:19:58: have you ever slept in that face, like because it seems like you open this up.

00:20:03: Then you had that idea.

00:20:04: And how was it like to manage all of this?

00:20:06: Yeah, I mean, it was a lot to manage.

00:20:08: I had a lot of a lot of artists working for me.

00:20:11: I had I had that up having seven studios in, in Long Island, New York

00:20:15: and, yeah, a lot of artists, you know, a lot of artists in and out.

00:20:19: And actually one thing that I started doing was, you know,

00:20:23: helping some international artists come to the United States, you know, so,

00:20:27: helping them to get O-1 work visas and,

00:20:31: you know, it was the early days of that because now there's, like, companies

00:20:34: that do that, you know,

00:20:36: but I used to just support the artists, myself.

00:20:38: And we had a,

00:20:41: a legal team and immigration legal team that,

00:20:44: you know, was out of New York that we worked together with.

00:20:46: And, you know, we used to bring the artist in and,

00:20:50: I had a lot of great artists come from other countries that,

00:20:53: you know, really it became a big part of their career to be able to do that.

00:20:57: So it was, you know, definitely, great to travel in the industry, too.

00:21:03: That's what I always loved about this industry is being able to,

00:21:07: you know, do your art and travel around the world and, you know,

00:21:12: get to meet different people from all over the world and have friends,

00:21:15: like, everywhere. It's it's it's really awesome.

00:21:18: It also gives you kind of like inspiration, you know,

00:21:20: like when you when you visit an event like this year

00:21:23: and you meet just your friends and stuff, it's just

00:21:25: you come back with a ton of new ideas, of new inspiration and everything.

00:21:29: And this is what I love about it,

00:21:31: because when I talk to people that are in the industry for so long

00:21:34: and even tattoo artists or whatever, most of them be like,

00:21:37: I don't go on conventions anymore and I'm done with it.

00:21:40: You know, also with the scene and everything.

00:21:43: But this is something that is pretty much, essential for me as an artist because,

00:21:47: like, this is the stuff that I love about tattooing.

00:21:50: This is what makes it makes it different, compared to other jobs.

00:21:54: Because, like, if I'm just an industry worker, it's

00:21:57: pretty hard for me to do some guest spots in another city, you know?

00:22:00: But, like, as a tattoo artist, it's really cool to do it like that.

00:22:04: Yeah, yeah.

00:22:05: I mean, I think, you know, it really opens your eyes to like,

00:22:09: you know, just seeing number one, different cultures.

00:22:12: Yeah.

00:22:12: You know, and you know, the, of course different styles of art

00:22:17: and learning from each other I think is really important.

00:22:21: you know, and, you know, just traveling is, is just such a great thing.

00:22:25: I mean, I did it for a long time.

00:22:27: I traveled all around the world, I. Bet still.

00:22:29: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it.

00:22:31: Covid had slowed down a lot, you know, and it's just I'm just starting

00:22:34: to really get back into it more, you know?

00:22:39: but yeah, but pre-COVID,

00:22:41: I was, you know, with the ink brand, I was all over the world.

00:22:44: I would be, you know, one weekend in Europe, the next weekend

00:22:48: in South America, you know, Asia,

00:22:51: China, you know, South Asia.

00:22:54: And then I'd be in Russia or, you know, it was it was it was a lot of traveling.

00:22:59: And, What was your favorite part in traveling so far?

00:23:02: Like where where would you like to go?

00:23:06: So I really enjoy Europe.

00:23:09: you know, I spent a lot of time in Italy, you know, started

00:23:12: actually the first convention that I did out of the United States with the ink

00:23:16: company was Milan.

00:23:17: That took a. Really? Yeah. Okay.

00:23:19: And it was, you know, really eye opening for me.

00:23:22: And it was it was fantastic.

00:23:23: And it was really the start of, you know, growing my brand. So,

00:23:29: you know, that it was I met a couple, tattoo artists from Italy on social media,

00:23:34: and that's how it started, you know, and then they like.

00:23:36: Yeah, you should come. Milan's a great show. And it is.

00:23:39: Yeah. Yeah, I've been there every year.

00:23:41: Every year since. Also this year.

00:23:44: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:23:45: So we probably met because I was there too. Yeah.

00:23:49: yeah.

00:23:49: Yeah. I mean it's an amazing show.

00:23:51: So, I've always enjoyed that.

00:23:53: And I think London, you know, those were my two favorite shows to go to.

00:23:59: but, you know, Italy.

00:24:00: I remember when I was in the hotel years ago, and it was like it was crazy.

00:24:05: I mean, it was so busy, you couldn't even walk in there, you know?

00:24:08: And, the,

00:24:09: the aisles were very small, and it was very different because of the hotel.

00:24:13: Instead of being in a big exposition center, you know,

00:24:18: but it was always fun because,

00:24:20: you know, you hung out in the lobby of the hotel

00:24:22: and you got to meet so many great artists and, you know,

00:24:26: distributors and supply companies and brands from all around

00:24:30: the world were there, you know, so that was a great place,

00:24:35: you know, for uniting people together from the industry.

00:24:40: but, you know, like that, that's why I traveled.

00:24:42: I mean, I just really like to meet different artists and,

00:24:45: you know, get to know them and introduce them to my brand, of course.

00:24:48: And, same with distributors, you know, you know, really getting building

00:24:52: that relationship with our distributors and, you know, supporting them as they're

00:24:56: supporting us with the, with the brand and, you know, just trying to help,

00:25:01: grow it and, you know, give the artists what they need.

00:25:05: I think that's always been an important thing to me is, you know,

00:25:10: making something that the artists need and want and, you know,

00:25:15: you know, you do things that are going to help

00:25:17: improve the artist and improve their work and, you know, help,

00:25:22: improve the industry, you know, so I think that that's always been something

00:25:26: that's been, a focus of mine is, you know, how do we make this industry better

00:25:30: or how do we make improvements on the products in the industry?

00:25:33: How do we how do we grow it, you know, as an industry and a whole?

00:25:37: And, I mean, you're doing more than good because, like, World Famous

00:25:40: is one of the top three world brands on the market right now.

00:25:43: And it's not around for that long, right.

00:25:47: started after the other ones.

00:25:48: Yeah, yeah.

00:25:49: I mean, I started in 2012.

00:25:51: Really? 2012. Yeah, yeah.

00:25:53: How how was the for me, it's pretty interesting because like,

00:25:56: I'm a tattoo artist, so I know about the scene and stuff, but,

00:26:02: I know about the scene and stuff, but how do you

00:26:04: when was the idea born where you wanted, like, okay, I'm doing colors.

00:26:10: so I mean, that goes back,

00:26:13: as I told you, I had, seven studios in Long Island,

00:26:16: New York, and back then it was very hard to get supplies,

00:26:20: you know, so there wasn't really, much out there.

00:26:24: And, I had originally started, another brand.

00:26:29: Well, and Kurt Sumi was one of them.

00:26:31: I had two brands or three years ago.

00:26:34: and, you know, I had,

00:26:37: I mean, I could just say it was, moms inc, millennium Colors.

00:26:41: I remember, yeah.

00:26:42: Yeah, that was my, original brand. I started,

00:26:46: and I had a partner, and

00:26:47: later on, we split up, and that's when I started World Famous Ink.

00:26:51: So, Yeah. So I, you know, like I had.

00:26:53: It wasn't that I started in 2012 doing ink,

00:26:57: or, you know, in this, you know, business.

00:27:00: So, I owned, technical tattoo supply back then.

00:27:04: Okay, out of New York and. crazy.

00:27:07: So many stuff.

00:27:08: Seven studios, and I get, like, a supply, but it's like a complete ecosystem.

00:27:13: You know? This is what I like about it. Well, that's what it was.

00:27:15: It was like there was a need. There was a huge need for it.

00:27:18: Like I said, you know, so, you know, I had these seven studios and I was like,

00:27:23: so hard, you know, like, I mean, first off,

00:27:25: needles, we were all soldering needles and everything,

00:27:28: and then inks, like, we were mixing inks in the back of the studio.

00:27:31: And, I remember at one point,

00:27:33: there was one company that came out with some inks, and,

00:27:36: I would call them up and say, hey, you know, I want to buy,

00:27:40: you know, a couple bottles, like, and they had these huge bottles,

00:27:42: like 16 ounce, you know, bottles and stuff.

00:27:45: It's like, yeah, I need a couple 16 ounce whites, you know, can you help me out?

00:27:49: And then, like. coming back for more next week?

00:27:51: They, they're like, it's about a six month waiting list.

00:27:57: I was like, are you kidding me?

00:27:59: Forget it. I'll make it myself.

00:28:00: I can't wait six months, you know?

00:28:02: So, that's what we would do.

00:28:04: And, you know, I saw that as a great opportunity and a great need.

00:28:09: And, you know, that's when, moms colors were born, you know, and,

00:28:15: I started that actually started doing

00:28:17: all my research in, like, 1995, 96.

00:28:21: And then, I opened up in 1998, in New York City.

00:28:25: So now I don't know if you know this, but tattooing was illegal.

00:28:29: I didn't in.

00:28:30: New York City until 1998.

00:28:33: So back in the 60s, there was,

00:28:36: you know, like, I don't know, it was like some

00:28:38: the rumor was that some judges daughter got tattooed

00:28:41: and this whole big thing happened, and it was like,

00:28:44: you know, that hepatitis scare or something, you know?

00:28:47: So it was like,

00:28:50: you know,

00:28:50: the thing was, as everybody was said from the industry back then, that it was

00:28:54: like some judge's daughter got tattooed, he got pissed off, and he closed down,

00:28:58: literally closed down tattooing in New York City.

00:29:02: Right.

00:29:03: Completely banned it. So,

00:29:06: you know, there was shops there in,

00:29:09: you know, the 80s, 90s, you know, underground

00:29:11: though they were like very private, you know, you.

00:29:13: In Japan nowadays.

00:29:15: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So,

00:29:17: you know, then, you know, in the 90s, like 96,

00:29:22: 97, it was like there was talks about, you know, legalizing it.

00:29:26: And I actually, you know, went down to the Department of Health,

00:29:30: they had a bunch of conferences about it and, you know, bringing the industry

00:29:34: together and asking questions and talking to people.

00:29:37: And so I was pretty heavily involved in that.

00:29:40: And, and then in 1998, we finally got it legalized, you know,

00:29:45: and it was it was great.

00:29:47: And I said, you know what?

00:29:49: Now that tattooing is legal in New York City, I'm going to open up a store

00:29:52: in New York City with the ink and supplies and, you know, machines.

00:29:57: We're building machines there.

00:29:59: And, you know, it it was great.

00:30:02: You know, we had all these new shops popping up everywhere in New York City.

00:30:07: And then, the cool thing, too, was that, you know, of course,

00:30:10: everybody goes to visit New York City. Who doesn't? Yeah.

00:30:13: So we would have all these artists that would come in from different countries,

00:30:18: and they would come visit and stop in the studio and, you know,

00:30:23: come check out our supplies and equipment and,

00:30:26: you know, then I then I realized, you know, being in New York City,

00:30:30: you know, you don't get much for your money,

00:30:32: you know, when it when you're talking about space.

00:30:34: Probably.

00:30:35: So I had this. Little scene, the means.

00:30:37: Yeah. I had this little tiny. Yeah. Right.

00:30:40: I had this little tiny store, and, I was paying

00:30:43: pretty big rent to keep this store alive, and, ten.

00:30:48: Grand for. Two.

00:30:50: And I ended up, moving

00:30:53: the supply company out to Long Island, you know, where my studios were.

00:30:57: And, you know, then we started shipping a lot.

00:31:00: So I realized that, you know, it was better to just ship it to the artist.

00:31:04: You know, they, you know, in New York, they had to take a subway or

00:31:07: you couldn't park.

00:31:08: There was like, nowhere to park, you know? So.

00:31:11: So now I was able to just, start shipping,

00:31:14: you know, UPS, Fedex, you know, post office, whatever it may be.

00:31:18: And then I, you know, I had, got a website and set up a website.

00:31:22: You know,

00:31:23: this is the beginning of the internet, you know, in the late 90s, you know, so,

00:31:28: yeah, I was one

00:31:28: of the first, you know, tattoo websites, you know,

00:31:32: for for supplies and stuff, and artists would go on and buy their stuff.

00:31:36: And so, yeah, I mean, that was,

00:31:40: that was how I got started in the supply company.

00:31:44: You know, I had,

00:31:45: you know, and I had all kinds of supplies, everything you know, and,

00:31:48: you know, like all the medical supplies and everything the tattoo parlor needed

00:31:51: eventually, little by little, growing it, and then,

00:31:56: and then, me and my partner just started shift

00:31:59: in different directions, and, you know, I wanted to continue to grow.

00:32:03: And he he really wasn't like, he I just had a different mindset, you know?

00:32:08: So we decided to part ways and, you know, and then I, left.

00:32:13: Well, I kind of told him, like, you buy me out or I buy you out, and I,

00:32:16: you know, like,

00:32:16: I wanted to take the company, but, you know, honestly, he was a little,

00:32:20: you know, big headed, but he was he didn't want to, part with it, and,

00:32:25: he probably should have, but, you know, I told him.

00:32:28: Okay, I'll leave, you know, you buy me out and,

00:32:32: but I'm not signing any non-compete or anything.

00:32:35: I'm telling you right now, I am starting another company doing exactly this.

00:32:39: And he was like, okay, good luck.

00:32:41: Okay, so that's when I started World Famous Ink, and,

00:32:44: and I actually took her sumi with me.

00:32:46: That that was, you know, one of the brands that we had a technical that.

00:32:50: I didn't do this before because it's always the word of tattooing

00:32:54: so small, and I didn't realize that it's actually that small.

00:32:58: You know? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So,

00:33:01: Yeah.

00:33:01: So then, you know, when I, when I, left and I started World Famous Ink, I,

00:33:07: you know, I had a lot of connections already around the world

00:33:10: because I, you know, had all my distributors.

00:33:12: And, you know, I started little by little, just converting people over,

00:33:16: to world famous and then,

00:33:18: you know, and then I started doing some heavy travel

00:33:21: and just traveling around, building those relationships with the distributors,

00:33:24: with the artist, and really just growing the brand country by country.

00:33:28: And, like I said, Milan Tattoo

00:33:30: Convention was really what opened my eyes to the rest of the world.

00:33:34: How is it for the manufacturing process?

00:33:36: Because obviously when you are the CEO, you're just traveling around

00:33:40: to NPR stuff, building networks and everything.

00:33:43: But how is it like, have you had to build, like, your own, manufacturer?

00:33:48: Was it like that? You,

00:33:50: just as like the, I'm liking the word for it.

00:33:54: So was whether, like, color manufacturers for probably different branches

00:33:58: where it just called and be like, yeah, I want to, set this product on the market,

00:34:02: like, can you do this for me or how does it work?

00:34:07: Good question. So,

00:34:09: yeah.

00:34:09: So I, I have our we have our own factory.

00:34:13: Okay. And we manufacture all colors.

00:34:16: but in the beginning, it was like we basically started

00:34:19: small and started in, like, a garage.

00:34:21: Really? Yeah.

00:34:23: You know, so it was just, you know, very small and just.

00:34:27: this is cool about America because in Germany,

00:34:29: this would never going to happen because we have so many regulations.

00:34:33: And so now there is.

00:34:35: But, you know, back then there was, you know, so in the beginning,

00:34:38: I mean, when I started World Famous, it was a it was a definitely more evolved.

00:34:41: But, you know, when I started my first company, it was it was very small and,

00:34:47: you know, I had done, done a bunch of research and I went to

00:34:50: I actually stopped in a guy, company

00:34:53: on Long Island that did, some pigment dispersions.

00:34:56: And, I was talking to them, and they were

00:34:59: they didn't want nobody wanted nothing to do with the tattoo industry, though.

00:35:02: They they were like, you know, oh, that's a liability.

00:35:05: We want nothing to do with that.

00:35:07: So the guy ended up like giving me a lot of information.

00:35:11: So I was able to absorb tons of information from this guy.

00:35:15: And, he wound up giving me a milling machine to.

00:35:19: Really? Yeah. Yeah. He's like, I got an old mill back there.

00:35:22: I'll give it to you. Like, that's a nice guy.

00:35:24: Yeah, it was really, really nice.

00:35:26: of him to do that.

00:35:27: And, you know, he he.

00:35:29: You're still in contact.

00:35:30: No, no, that was many years ago. Yeah.

00:35:32: I should go back and see if that guy is still around.

00:35:34: I did invite him to just sort of.

00:35:36: Yeah, he'll see what I have done. Went see what has happened.

00:35:38: Yeah. Yeah.

00:35:39: It's true.

00:35:40: it was a very long time ago, but, Yeah.

00:35:43: So that that was like, how it first started and then,

00:35:47: then I went to, another company and I started talking to them

00:35:52: about helping us out and, you know, making some dispersions for us.

00:35:55: Right.

00:35:56: And, again, the same thing happened, like, they actually did a lot of research.

00:36:01: They had a lab, they had a guy in a lab, and, he did a lot of research

00:36:05: and did a lot of work on on the colors. And,

00:36:09: and then the the

00:36:10: company decided the legal department told him, don't do it, you know?

00:36:14: No, don't get involved in at that doing this thing. So,

00:36:18: I wound up the funny part is, is

00:36:21: I wound up talking to the guy in a lab, and I hired him.

00:36:24: Be. Yeah. Okay. They forbid. You okay?

00:36:27: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So he he was all into it.

00:36:29: He wanted to like, you know, start this up and get it. Go.

00:36:32: And he was he was pissed off because he did so much work on it.

00:36:36: And then they wouldn't they wouldn't, you know, let him do it.

00:36:40: So he was like, really upset.

00:36:41: I think this is the kind of people you need

00:36:43: when you want to open up a business, you know, people that are on fire

00:36:46: for the topic, that are like, no matter what, I'm going to do it.

00:36:49: Yeah. Yeah.

00:36:50: So that was that was like the start of like moms and Katsumi back

00:36:54: then and you know, and we, we opened the small facility and then,

00:36:58: you know, and then it,

00:36:59: you know, became bigger and bigger and bigger over the years.

00:37:02: And then when I left and opened World Famous,

00:37:06: you know,

00:37:06: we started, you know, I hooked up with,

00:37:09: I hired a guy who was,

00:37:12: you know, a manufacturing.

00:37:15: Actually, I worked first a little bit with a third party

00:37:18: who was helping us out, you know, doing some contract manufacturing.

00:37:21: And then the guy who ran everything there

00:37:25: wound up leaving and coming with me.

00:37:28: So then then we.

00:37:30: Then I opened my own facility,

00:37:33: you know, doing the pigments and stuff there.

00:37:35: And, he's been fantastic and been been with me since, you know,

00:37:40: you know, he, he was, like, thinking about

00:37:44: leaving and opening up his own dispersion company, and,

00:37:48: you know, he had reached out to me and he's like, what do you think?

00:37:51: Can we do something?

00:37:52: And I'm like, yeah, let's go.

00:37:53: Come on. Cool. So, Yeah. So.

00:37:56: And then, he helped me out with, getting world famous going, and,

00:38:00: so it was good because I got to do all the traveling,

00:38:02: you know, he ran the, facility, you know, manufacturing and,

00:38:07: you know, as we grew, we just kept, you know, moving

00:38:10: to different locations, growing the factory and bigger and bigger.

00:38:14: And was it like, was it, like, profitable from the first time, or was it like,

00:38:18: okay, you need to spend like 1 or 2 years until it became.

00:38:23: Yeah, I mean, it

00:38:23: takes time, you know, it's it's, you know, I mean,

00:38:26: you know, there's there's good profit in, in inks, but,

00:38:31: you know, you got to spend a lot of money on marketing and stuff like that.

00:38:35: Manufacturing, I. Bet.

00:38:36: Yeah, yeah, especially in the beginning, though, you know,

00:38:39: you know, you know, you start off the first few years as a company

00:38:43: and you're just like a negative, you know, it's like it's like, oh, crap.

00:38:47: You know, I hope this turns around. You know.

00:38:49: Everybody's like,

00:38:50: are you really sure you want to do this and be like, trust me, trust me.

00:38:53: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:38:54: So, well, you know, when you have passion

00:38:58: and you know that you can succeed and you really want to strive

00:39:03: for being something great and making a difference in the industry.

00:39:08: And, just having, you know, I've always concentrated on quality.

00:39:11: I always wanted best of the best quality.

00:39:13: Nothing, nothing else works.

00:39:16: So, you know, knowing that that was my focus

00:39:19: and that's what we were going to do.

00:39:21: And we were going to build relationships with distributors and artists and,

00:39:24: you know, give them great quality inks and, you know, make a difference,

00:39:29: you know, so that that's, that's what makes success is making a difference.

00:39:34: And I mean, at least like you, when you had like that amount of studios

00:39:37: also what the relationship with international artists,

00:39:40: I think it's way easier to do it when you are already a part of the scene

00:39:44: than when you just come from somewhere else

00:39:46: and then try to get a foot in there and don't know how the network itself works.

00:39:50: And everything.

00:39:51: Yeah, exactly.

00:39:53: You know, just,

00:39:54: I mean, being a tattoo artist and knowing how the ink works and,

00:39:58: you know, I mean, my my, lab guy, you know, he would

00:40:03: he would come sit with me while I tattooed, and I would,

00:40:07: you know, he'd make me samples and I would work with them, and,

00:40:11: you know, we'd go back and forth and I'd tell them that

00:40:14: it's got to be a little thinner, a thicker,

00:40:16: you know, something's not working, right.

00:40:17: Let's fix this. Let's figure out how to do this.

00:40:20: And that's that's how, you know, we basically built it.

00:40:23: I mean, you know, you build build the product based on how it

00:40:27: how it worked, you know, and how how how well it went in the skin.

00:40:30: Learning by doing.

00:40:32: Right.

00:40:32: And, and and you know, how it healed was a big thing.

00:40:36: So, you know, I wanted to make a product that went in the skin easier,

00:40:40: you know, because think about it, there's less trauma to the skin, you know?

00:40:44: So if it goes in easier, you got less trauma.

00:40:46: You can pack it really well and solid and, you know, a product

00:40:51: that heals very well, heals quickly, you know, is important too.

00:40:55: So you know that that's how I made the best product

00:40:59: I could was just to sit there tattooing and,

00:41:02: you know, figuring it out together with my, my scientist guy, you know?

00:41:06: So, we, we worked on it together and,

00:41:10: you know, then we started giving out samples to different artists and let them

00:41:13: test and get the feedback, you know, like, you know, nothing's perfect.

00:41:17: Yeah.

00:41:18: You know, especially when you're first starting,

00:41:19: you know, it's like, it's like, how do we make improvements?

00:41:22: How do we make it better?

00:41:23: And and you know, even today, like it's always continuous improvement, you know,

00:41:27: that we're doing and you're always making, you know any improvements I can

00:41:31: of course you got regulations that's going to change things in the European Union.

00:41:36: You'll get you'll get regulations that'll throw a wrench in everything.

00:41:39: And then you got to start all over from scratch.

00:41:41: Yeah.

00:41:42: Like the new regulations.

00:41:43: But, But I think, like, you guys were one of the first companies

00:41:47: that already had, like this,

00:41:50: the what's it called?

00:41:51: The limitless. Right? Yeah, yeah. Just serious. Yeah.

00:41:53: Yeah, yeah.

00:41:54: I mean, we would we would definitely, the first, to market,

00:41:58: I think, in colors, you know, and yeah, it was a lot of hard work, though,

00:42:03: I will tell you, my team, like, they kicked ass, you know,

00:42:07: and we spent, you know, a full year,

00:42:09: like the the regulations came out,

00:42:12: and then they gave us a full year to comply, you know, which.

00:42:16: Is not too much.

00:42:18: It's not really a lot when you think about it, because you're

00:42:20: you're redoing everything, you know, you reformulated everything from scratch.

00:42:24: So, and you had to figure out all these, you know, chemicals

00:42:29: and you know, everything that, you know, you can't have in the ink.

00:42:33: And you, you know, I mean, you know, we're using pigments.

00:42:37: So you know,

00:42:37: you got to do all this testing on the pigments

00:42:40: and find the right pigments that are going to work and not, you know,

00:42:43: have like heavy metals or Roman gamings, you know,

00:42:48: anything in it that's

00:42:49: going to be against the regulations, you know,

00:42:53: and then, you know, every ingredient that goes in there has to be,

00:42:56: you know, vetted and tested and, you know, making

00:42:59: sure that everything passes before you start putting formulas together.

00:43:03: Yeah.

00:43:04: Also, like I imagine that you have need to like a trial phase

00:43:08: where you can just hand it out to artists and be like, yeah, please test it out.

00:43:11: And then you see it.

00:43:12: He'll see it after one months, two months, six months, whatever.

00:43:16: Yeah.

00:43:16: That was the biggest challenge actually, because,

00:43:19: you know, we had we had wrote letters, you know, during the regulation changes

00:43:24: when they were trying to do it, that, you know,

00:43:27: giving us only one year is not enough time for testing.

00:43:30: You know,

00:43:32: Probably if you just need to do the testing in a year, it's

00:43:35: probably okay, but not if you also need to do the development in the year.

00:43:39: Right? Right, right.

00:43:40: Well, the R&D work that goes into it prior to getting into the skin and,

00:43:45: you know, seeing how it reacts in the skin, you know, is is a big deal.

00:43:49: And, you know, like

00:43:51: a, you know, one year was a very short time to be able to do that.

00:43:54: But like I said, our team,

00:43:57: you know, at this point, you know, the team was much larger.

00:44:00: So I had a, you know, like five person R&D team that was, you know,

00:44:04: working on it 24 over seven for for a year.

00:44:07: You know, I mean, literally that's all they did.

00:44:09: I mean, and they, they put in a lot of extra hours

00:44:13: overtime, weekends, you know, they, they worked really hard on it.

00:44:17: And you know, everybody wanted to get to that goal.

00:44:21: And, you know, I mean, honestly, we've incentivized

00:44:25: the team to, to make it happen and,

00:44:28: you know, made sure that they were taking care of for all their hard work and,

00:44:33: you know, we were able to get there, but,

00:44:35: you know, it was definitely a I'm not going to say it was easy.

00:44:38: You know, it was definitely a very, very big challenge.

00:44:41: And, you know, and and you see things today to like where,

00:44:45: you know, I thought this new regulation for reach would be just like, okay,

00:44:49: this is the regulation for all of Europe, because the biggest challenge

00:44:53: always in Europe is that each country has different regulations.

00:44:57: So with the race at 2003, 2008 that they had previously

00:45:02: that would like the suggested guidelines for, you know, manufacturing inks,

00:45:08: each country would have a different rule on it or a different law.

00:45:12: And it was.

00:45:12: Like, you can just build a factory for each country, you know?

00:45:15: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:45:16: So, but now we're seeing that, like, you know,

00:45:19: there still is other rules in each country.

00:45:23: So you still you can't just go by, you know, the reach regulation that you think

00:45:29: is all of Europe because each country has like different regulations.

00:45:33: Yeah.

00:45:33: So, you know, so it's definitely a big challenge.

00:45:36: I would prefer it to be more of a unified regulation this way.

00:45:42: All of us do it. Yeah.

00:45:43: I mean, you know what you're

00:45:44: you're up against in every single country where, you know, I mean, it

00:45:48: it gets very difficult like that and hadn't even like USA and you know,

00:45:53: you know, Canada and you know, we have like different regulations

00:45:57: in different places then you got Brazil is a whole nother story, you know.

00:46:01: Is it like the formula?

00:46:03: It's just the limitless serious and the regulation is right.

00:46:06: There's no difference in between the countries.

00:46:10: Right.

00:46:11: No no, no.

00:46:11: So yeah, you just have the, the classic formula and then the, limitless.

00:46:18: So the limitless we created, just for Europe, you know.

00:46:22: So it's only sold in Europe.

00:46:24: it's not sold anywhere else. But,

00:46:27: you know,

00:46:27: we've thought about selling it other places, and

00:46:31: but it's just confusing to artists, like, why have they after, like, oh, you have,

00:46:36: you know, all these colors, you know, I mean, we got like,

00:46:39: hundreds and hundreds of colors in each, each line, you know?

00:46:43: So it's like, now you just going to confuse people

00:46:45: even more by, by selling multiple, you know,

00:46:49: formulas in different, you know, in the same country, you know.

00:46:53: So, yeah, we decided to just keep it as a separate thing,

00:46:57: you know,

00:46:57: just all of Europe gets this formula, and the rest of the world has the other form.

00:47:02: Which is kind of like ridiculous.

00:47:03: If, like Europe and the rest of the world.

00:47:05: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's exactly what it is.

00:47:08: It really is.

00:47:08: It's not, you know, there is nowhere else that has,

00:47:12: you know, these kind of stringent regulations.

00:47:16: Brazil has it's more of,

00:47:20: like getting the doing all this work to get an anvisa to import to Brazil.

00:47:25: so I, we might need the European regulatory, you know, formula for that.

00:47:30: We haven't worked on that.

00:47:31: It's been something that I've always been on the back burner for me.

00:47:34: I like to, to work on.

00:47:35: We have a lot of, artists in Brazil that are always asking for the products.

00:47:40: I think the market itself is also like quite small, because when you want to,

00:47:45: distribute everything to Europe, of course, it's way bigger.

00:47:48: The value is also more than just just Brazil.

00:47:51: Right? Right. Right. Definitely. Yeah. I mean, Brazil is a big country.

00:47:54: So, you know, I think it's got a decent market, that market there.

00:47:58: But yeah, I mean, Europe's much bigger.

00:48:01: United States is a, awesome market for us.

00:48:03: And, you know, we're seeing a lot of,

00:48:07: you know, the market, tattooing

00:48:08: really just growing in Asia, too, for us, you know, and,

00:48:12: you know, so I think,

00:48:14: all around the world.

00:48:16: So for us, you know, it's USA and Europe is, top.

00:48:19: Yeah.

00:48:20: What are the next plans for a world famous?

00:48:23: So what's what's the next plan on the,

00:48:26: the next milestone that we are hitting?

00:48:30: so, yeah, I mean, we're just always looking ahead and just seeing

00:48:33: what the future is going to bring, and, you know, working with new artist.

00:48:38: so we got some, great new artists

00:48:40: that, will be appearing on the team and, Really excited for.

00:48:45: Yeah, yeah.

00:48:45: So, can't make any announcements yet, but,

00:48:49: and we're going to be doing, some new sets.

00:48:53: I don't know if you saw those.

00:48:53: Sasha and set.

00:48:55: we just came out with that,

00:48:57: you know, we introduced here at the show at Gods of Ink.

00:49:00: Okay. And,

00:49:01: Yeah, that that's a set that,

00:49:03: we've been working on for quite some time, and,

00:49:05: and we did a really beautiful, presentation box.

00:49:09: you know, came out really nice and,

00:49:12: people, really checking it out.

00:49:14: I mean, they haven't, you know, not too many people have used it yet.

00:49:16: Besides, Sasha's been using it for quite a while.

00:49:21: and, he gave it out to, some friends of hers,

00:49:23: and they've been using it for, like, a year.

00:49:26: So, you know, we did a lot of testing, and that's an example, like,

00:49:29: you know, like, literally we did a lot of testing on the colors and,

00:49:33: you know, and the thickness and viscosities of it.

00:49:37: And, you know, Sasha was very particular.

00:49:39: I mean, he's a very particular person.

00:49:41: And he's like, I wanted, you know, to be a little bit thicker, a little bit.

00:49:45: There's a little bit that, you know, and we

00:49:47: we worked on it developing that for like a couple of years training.

00:49:51: And then he's been testing it for a year, you know.

00:49:53: And but his friends have been testing it.

00:49:55: So but it makes sense right. Yeah.

00:49:57: This is something that you want you know, because if you want to hand out

00:50:01: like samples to an artist, you don't want him to say,

00:50:03: yeah, that's the best, that's the best and still do something else.

00:50:05: But you want him to have an honest opinion and just talk to it, you know?

00:50:09: Right? Right. Right, right.

00:50:11: Yeah.

00:50:11: So I mean, he was he was very passionate about it and,

00:50:14: you know, and he came to our facility and we work, you know, with our team,

00:50:19: you know,

00:50:20: mixing colors and trying to figure out, you know, the best formula for him.

00:50:24: And, yeah, I mean, he's a great guy, great guy to work with, but,

00:50:28: yeah, we got some other, you know, great artists that are going to be joining

00:50:32: the team in that we're working already on their their, ink sets. Too.

00:50:37: They also come to the factory

00:50:38: and check everything out there and just mix it by themselves or

00:50:43: just to get a feeling for it sometimes.

00:50:46: Not always.

00:50:46: But, yeah, we like to get them out there and, you know, work together,

00:50:51: like, get to know the R&D team that really,

00:50:54: you know, work with them and figure it out together.

00:50:58: but, you know, sometimes it's difficult with,

00:51:00: you know, people being in different countries.

00:51:01: But of course, if not, it's just a lot of communication, back and forth

00:51:06: and a lot of shipping back and forth of different samples to test and,

00:51:11: till we finally get, get them to say

00:51:14: that's the one,

00:51:18: that.

00:51:18: That's the one or just say, you know what?

00:51:21: I thought about it.

00:51:22: let's do something completely different.

00:51:24: Yeah, yeah, it does happen.

00:51:25: It does happen. Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:51:28: I mean, you know, getting.

00:51:29: Phone calls and be like, you know, lieu of.

00:51:32: I thought about it,

00:51:33: I know we spent like three years for it, and we switched it completely.

00:51:38: It does happen.

00:51:39: And for sure, you know, can happen.

00:51:41: I've seen it all. Believe me, I guess.

00:51:44: Yeah, right.

00:51:45: So cool.

00:51:46: How big is world famous itself?

00:51:48: How many employees does world famous have?

00:51:50: world famous has 100 employees.

00:51:52: 100 employees?

00:51:53: Yeah. That's a lot. Yeah. Yep.

00:51:57: yeah, we got a great

00:51:58: team, you know, from from the factory manufacturing to,

00:52:03: you know, logistics and, you know, bottling.

00:52:06: There's a lot of people in the bottling department and labeling.

00:52:10: and then, you know, even just office,

00:52:12: at marketing team,

00:52:15: And everything is produced in the USA, right?

00:52:18: Also the European colors and everything. Yeah.

00:52:20: Yeah, I would love to, you know, I one day

00:52:23: I would love to manufacture the European stuff in Europe.

00:52:27: You know, we'll figure that out one day.

00:52:29: But, yeah, right now everything is made in USA and

00:52:33: and shipped here.

00:52:36: so we,

00:52:38: you know, we also have the convention teams, like, we have the team

00:52:41: here in Europe.

00:52:42: So we have a specific team that just does European shows.

00:52:45: So cool.

00:52:46: And then we have, a team that does, shows all across the United States,

00:52:50: and we have a team for, South America.

00:52:54: And, we actually now have,

00:52:57: couple of guys who work for us in China

00:52:59: who are, starting to do some shows and,

00:53:03: you know, going around and meeting artist and, you know,

00:53:06: supporting the artist and, you know, doing some sales with distributors.

00:53:10: So, yeah.

00:53:11: So we're building this team, more and more, every day.

00:53:15: This is so cool to hear from somebody that came from scratch

00:53:19: and did like such a big impact, not also on the scene,

00:53:23: but also like on the business base, you know, because

00:53:26: when you have to administrate 100 people,

00:53:30: different teams and everything, how it's how it's like the regular days of yours.

00:53:34: So how do you like I asked that before the you sleep?

00:53:39: yeah.

00:53:40: I mean, I sleep pretty good usually because,

00:53:43: you know, work hard all the time and, crash.

00:53:47: Yeah, until I crash and then, but I'm a I'm a very,

00:53:53: early person.

00:53:54: Early bird.

00:53:54: You know, I wake up, I usually, usually I'm up at, like, 4:00 in the morning.

00:54:00: Yeah.

00:54:01: And I start my day, you know, sending out

00:54:03: emails and reading emails and,

00:54:07: and while I'm drinking my coffee and then, yeah,

00:54:10: then the day progresses, and then there's a lot of meetings and stuff that go on.

00:54:14: And, but I have a great management team, so, you know,

00:54:17: the managers, you know, handle day to day operations.

00:54:20: Now, at this point, you know, I'm able to,

00:54:24: just be at a very high level

00:54:26: and make high level decisions.

00:54:29: but I always work with the marketing team and, you know, because,

00:54:32: you know, I want to make sure that they understand also,

00:54:35: you know, coming from the industry and being an artist,

00:54:38: you know, like sometimes marketing teams will do some crazy things.

00:54:41: And I'm like, no.

00:54:42: Yeah definitely not.

00:54:44: I'm like, that doesn't go get rid of it.

00:54:47: so you got to definitely, be careful and be.

00:54:51: yeah.

00:54:51: So traditionally you wouldn't expect it from us

00:54:53: because we are so heavily tattooed and everything, and

00:54:56: some of the guys are punks and everything, but they're it's just like, yeah,

00:54:59: you know, we are kind of traditional when it comes to the values of tattooing.

00:55:03: Exactly. Yeah, definitely.

00:55:05: You know,

00:55:07: yeah.

00:55:08: Just, you know, making sure that, everybody's keeping in line

00:55:11: and I try to hire, you know, some industry people to like,

00:55:16: you know, like, frosty.

00:55:18: That works for me here at the conventions, like he oversees

00:55:21: now, all the conventions, United States and Europe and, and South America,

00:55:27: he oversees them all, like, he's he's like the top guy in the conventions now. And,

00:55:33: he, he was a tattoo artist.

00:55:35: And then, you know, he he even pierced and, and then he started in my warehouse.

00:55:40: So I love to see people elevate through the company, too.

00:55:43: He started in the warehouse.

00:55:45: just doing shipping of some products and worked his way up

00:55:49: to, like, a warehouse manager.

00:55:51: And then he managed, customer service a little bit, and,

00:55:55: then he worked conventions for a while,

00:55:58: previous to, you know, working as a warehouse manager.

00:56:02: And I actually brought him from the conventions back to the warehouse

00:56:06: because I needed a good manager

00:56:08: and somebody who knows and understands the industry.

00:56:11: And then, and then, you know, I needed somebody to had the, tattoo

00:56:17: conventions, and I was like, all right, we got a good industry guy here, frosty.

00:56:21: So he's going to go, take care of that.

00:56:23: So I put him in that position, but, yeah, it's really cool to see,

00:56:27: you know, and I have employees that work for me

00:56:30: in the manufacturing that have been there since day one of the company.

00:56:34: Cool. so it's really cool. Yeah, really, really cool.

00:56:36: And, also, a salesman that's, been with me since day one, so.

00:56:42: So when I moved my company from New York

00:56:45: to South Carolina, at that time, I had like 25 employees.

00:56:48: And, I was like, how am I going to do this?

00:56:51: You know, it all started with my wife

00:56:53: wanting to get to warmer weather and get out of the dark.

00:56:55: And I'm like, all right, well.

00:56:57: It was a bunch of crazy people around. Let's move.

00:57:00: Yeah, yeah,

00:57:01: well, we wanted to get the warmer weather, but we didn't really care for Florida.

00:57:05: So we were like, let's just go halfway in the middle.

00:57:07: So we went to the Carolinas and, I went into my office

00:57:12: and I said to all my employees, I gathered everybody up, and I said,

00:57:16: I said, hey, listen, I'm thinking about moving the company to the Carolinas.

00:57:19: You all want to come with me?

00:57:20: And everybody's like, yeah, let's go. Sure.

00:57:23: I was like, aren't you? Never asked.

00:57:24: Wow, that's great.

00:57:25: I was like, I was like, this makes it so much easier for you.

00:57:28: So I don't have to worry about hiring new people.

00:57:30: You know, or anything like that.

00:57:31: And, you know, like, I got loyalty to my people, too,

00:57:34: because they've been with me a long time and they work well.

00:57:38: They work very hard.

00:57:39: And, you know, I really appreciate them and take care of them, too, you know?

00:57:42: So, so, you know, and they respect me, you know, so, it's a great thing.

00:57:48: And they all picked up and moved, you know,

00:57:51: and, and, you know, when we first started talking about it, it was like,

00:57:56: we all want to go.

00:57:57: And then I came down, I went down to the Carolinas.

00:58:00: I looked around, I was like, wasn't really sure.

00:58:03: And I came back, and then they started pushing me.

00:58:05: When are we going? When are we going? You know, I mean, like, think about it.

00:58:08: You know, cost of living in New York is much higher, you know, so

00:58:12: they were able to move to the Carolinas and, you know, live more affordably

00:58:16: and, and buy houses and stuff that they couldn't do in New York, you know.

00:58:20: So, it was a big change, a life for the positive for,

00:58:24: for everybody, you know, and, you know, when they started pushing me, my,

00:58:28: my ad sales guy there, Tony, he was like, he was like, don't push him too hard.

00:58:34: Because when he when he says, go, it's going to happen fast.

00:58:36: Of course. And that's exactly what happened.

00:58:38: So I was like, all right, fine, I'll go down again.

00:58:40: I went down, I looked, I found a building that we're in right now still. And,

00:58:45: I came back and I'm like, okay, we got two months.

00:58:47: You got to move.

00:58:48: And everybody was just like, Hey, just stuff in order.

00:58:51: Yeah.

00:58:52: I said everybody like, take, take a week off and go take turns

00:58:56: taking a week off and go look in the Carolinas,

00:58:58: find somewhere to live and pack your shit and let's get out of here.

00:59:04: Did you,

00:59:06: stop tattooing or do you still do it?

00:59:08: Occasionally?

00:59:10: yeah.

00:59:10: It got to a point at one point where I had to make a decision.

00:59:13: You know, it really, it was honor for tattooing on a regular basis,

00:59:18: you know, it was just very difficult to run the whole company and

00:59:23: and grow the company and be in the tattoo chair because, you know, and, you know,

00:59:28: you got to make a lot of phone calls for business and always on the phone.

00:59:32: And it's not fair to your client either.

00:59:34: If you're sitting there on the phone the whole time while you're tattooing.

00:59:37: so, you know, it started out that's how it was.

00:59:39: It was like, I'm on the phone, I'm tattooing.

00:59:41: I'm like going back and forth.

00:59:42: I'm taking breaks with phone calls and, you know, so it was it was rough.

00:59:47: And then finally I had to first I started tattooing, only on the weekends.

00:59:52: So I would,

00:59:53: you know, run the company during the week and then tattoo on the weekends.

00:59:57: And then afterwards I had to make a decision that, you know,

01:00:00: I need I need quality of life a little bit to, you know, and, you know,

01:00:04: me and my wife are together like, 30 years now, so, yeah, we have three children.

01:00:09: So, you know, it's great.

01:00:11: you know, you got to have that family life.

01:00:14: You have to have that work life balance and, you know, try and figure out what,

01:00:18: what works best to to be able to enjoy the family and enjoy enjoy life also.

01:00:24: Yeah.

01:00:24: Because, you know, life is short, you know, I mean, and

01:00:27: and the older you get, the more

01:00:28: you start to think about that and you start, you know, you start

01:00:32: seeing friends and people that that pass away or something.

01:00:36: And yeah, it's something happens and and you, you get scared

01:00:39: and you start to think about it like, oh man, I gotta, I gotta make sure that,

01:00:43: you know, enjoying my life and my family too.

01:00:46: Yeah.

01:00:46: Because hustling is fun, but it's also like, there's not much

01:00:49: you have when you just pass, you know, there's nothing you can take with you.

01:00:53: Yeah.

01:00:54: So yeah, I mean, I and once in a while I try and like do a little tattoo here

01:00:58: or there and, I have an idea for the, for the,

01:01:02: people that that, are still at world famous, you know, from day one,

01:01:06: once world famous hits 20 years, everybody gets logo tattooed by you.

01:01:11: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's cool. Something like.

01:01:13: We actually, I was in Italy at the Milan Tattoo convention one time, and,

01:01:19: one of the artists was

01:01:20: doing a, grand opening party at his, studio,

01:01:24: and I went to the studio and,

01:01:28: you know, we were all drinking and having a good time, and everybody's.

01:01:30: So somebody stands up and they're like, we're all getting tattooed by Lou tonight.

01:01:36: I was like, what?

01:01:38: So it was funny.

01:01:39: I ended up, just doing a,

01:01:42: like on on a bunch of the artists.

01:01:43: So it was like, 7 or 8 artists that I kind.

01:01:47: Yeah, yeah, yeah, just did a little, for World Famous on them and,

01:01:51: a couple little stars around it, like old school style and,

01:01:55: you know, and everybody loved it.

01:01:57: They had a blast.

01:01:57: And we took pictures and, you know, but it was it was fun.

01:02:00: It was a good time, you know? Really cool, man.

01:02:03: Thanks a lot.

01:02:04: So unfortunately, we just hit an hour.

01:02:07: Wow. That went fast.

01:02:08: That one fast, right? I said in the beginning, how

01:02:11: what are we going to talk about for an hour?

01:02:13: I thought it was ten minutes, but now it's like way, way less.

01:02:16: Yeah. Really cool.

01:02:17: So, tradition in our podcast is that, that the guest has the last word.

01:02:22: So if you want to greet somebody, if you want to,

01:02:26: get your Instagram handles, whatever, you can just feel free to do so now.

01:02:30: Sure.

01:02:32: at World Famous Inc is our Instagram handle, and,

01:02:36: I hope to, meet you or see you sometime

01:02:39: at, maybe Gods of Ink tattoo convention,

01:02:42: or somewhere in this world and,

01:02:45: you know, just enjoy life and

01:02:48: and enjoy the art of tattooing because it is such an amazing art.

01:02:51: I think it's one of the most amazing arts in the world.

01:02:54: That's cool. Thank you so much for being with me.

01:02:56: Thanks for having me here.